Our Guest Dr. Mark Gabriel
Sid: I have a friend on the telephone Dr. Mark Gabriel. I’m speaking to him somewhere in Florida. That is not his real name because previously he was a professor of Islamic history at the most prestigious Islamic university in the world. We found out on yesterday’s broadcast he began to question the contradictions that he saw in the Quran. The Secret Police got ahold of him, he wasn’t a believer in Jesus he just questioned all of these contradictions that were there. They put him in a prison for 3 days without food and water, they whipped him, he was supernaturally protected. He cried out to God he didn’t even know who God was but he said “God help me.” They put a vicious dog in the same cell with him that was very hungry and the dog started licking him rather than killing him. They put in water with rats swimming up to his head and these rats were hungry and they didn’t harm him either. He was wondering “Who’s this God that’s protecting me?” So time went on… you went to a pharmacy because you had… what did you have a bad headache?
Mark: I had one… I lived for 1 year without faith because I’m already I lost my faith in Islam. I spent a whole year questioning myself searching for the true God who can be. I ask myself its can be the God of Hinduism?” I said “No no no God can’t be a cow. He must be more greater than that.”
Sid: So it wasn’t a God of Hinduism, okay.
Mark: So I just come really during that year I had a terrible headache because I never stopped asking myself, searching, and questioning you see about the true God who can be. The One who delivered me from the prison, the One He delivered me from the hand of the persecutors you see. One day I went to the doctor pharmacy, I was always going to this pharmacy to get this type of headache tablet. So when I went to there one day and the doctor pharmacy and she know me, she know my family, and she was really wondering what’s really going on in my life. She was worried I was going to be addicted for these tablets. She told me “What’s going on in your life? Why you keep taking these tablets all the time? I am worried about you.” I told her I don’t know just because I can’t sleep every night I can’t sleep. She asked me “What’s going on?” So I told her “I’m searching for my God. I searched, I don’t know He is the God of Judaism, the God of Christianity, the god of Islam I do know him exactly. I know his story exactly, but the God Judaism, the God of Hinduism I don’t know who is the true God can be.” She just smiled and she told me “Okay I’m going to give you these tablets like always, but I’m going to give you this book this is my Bible. Take and before you take your tablets tonight open it and try to read something and see how you’re going to feel. If you will feel nothing just close it and go ahead and take your tablets.” So I take the Bible from her, I take the tablets also. I went to my home and I sit in my room and I start to read the Bible before I take the tablets and find myself I start to read in Matthew chapter 5 the sermon of the mountain. I was shocked when I start to read and see what the Lord Jesus Christ telling His disciples and the crowd was sitting around Him. My brain automatically start to bring the Quranic teaching about Jesus. During my reading of the sermon of the mountain, I felt that the Lord Himself He did this appointment with me and came tonight to reach out to my heart and to introduce Himself to me and to give me the true picture about Him who is Jesus. So I was shocked by His teaching “Love your enemies.” I love my enemies how come? How come Islam does not teach me in all my life to love my enemy? Islam does teach “Eye by eye, and a tooth by tooth.” Islam does not teach me to love my enemy. So “Bless who curse you.” I find the word afterward in the sermon of the mountain came as a clear message to present to me the true picture about the heavenly God, about the heart of God towards His creation His people. I did discover that yes this is it the true God.
Sid: Now you told people about this and you were kicked out of the university, you were kicked out of the mosque, and as a matter of fact 2 men were sent to kill you. What happened?
Mark: One day I was just walking back to my home and 2 guys they came and because they wasn’t understanding and they was believed I was kicked from the mosque, and I was kicked from the university. They was thinking I am converted from Islam… particularly with Muslims they see some person leave Islam, or they are thinking that he became a Christian. So this is why they came and they tried to end my life. Why? Because they want to please God because the Islamic law says “The judgment of the apostasy, the person who’s going to leave Islam the judgment is for him must be killed.” The person who’s going to kill me he’s going to honor Allah for killing me. Let’s say you’re going to see in my book when my father he came and discovered my conversion and he came to kill me himself, my father, my own father, I am his blood and flesh, but he want to honor Allah in his life. The desire of Allah for him is more than his son.
Sid: How did you survive with these 2 men they stabbed you why weren’t you killed?
Mark: They stabbed me when they saw the blood comes from everywhere in my body I fainted and I fell on the floor and they think I was finished. There was lots of cowards and they ran away quickly, they do not want to wait more so they can catch by the police or something like that. They ran away and the police they came and they take me from the ground and they called the hospital car and they take me to the hospital.
Sid: When your father came to kill you with a gun what happened?
Mark: I was standing outside my house, my father he was talking to me and he find out that there is a chain around my neck. This chain carries the cross but the cross it was covered by my t-shirt. I received that cross from a Christian guy and I meet with him in South Africa when my father sent me to South Africa for a business trip for his business. My father came and asked me “You are the Imam, you are… How come you put a chain around your neck?” According to the Islamic and Arabic culture if a man puts a chain around his neck this is very bad.
Sid: The chain with the cross?
Mark: But he didn’t see the cross.
Sid: Oh, just the chain was upsetting.
Mark: Yeah I don’t know who moved my time to tell him “No my father this is not a chain, this is a cross.” I took the cross and I showed him “Now I believe in Jesus Christ He is my Lord and my Savior.” When I told him this he just fainted on the floor, he’s on the ground. When he fainted on the ground I discovered, I understand that my father that he will end my life. He will not leave me to go away, so I ran away from him to my sister’s house; I ran from him. My brother’s and some people from our neighborhood they came and helped him and when he stand up he take his handgun and he just looked for me and he find me just far away from him and he starts shooting towards me. The Lord just delivered me from his bullets. I ran to my sister’s house and from there I start to commit my situation to the Lord in my prayer and ask the Lord to show me where I’m going to that evening, and how I’m going to live in this country.
Sid: We’ll let them read the full story in the book, but Mark I want to now fast forward this is now 10 years later. I must understand what is the goal of Islam in reference to the United States of America?
Mark: The goal of Islam before September 11 maybe 20 or 50 years ago was perpetrated by the Islamic Mission Activity to reach out to America and to convert the American to Islam. Ultimately they will see America will become an Islamic country. The same way they did in England.
Sid: You know… well tell me how did they do it in England that might interesting?
Mark: In England they did also they did that through the Muslim Mission Activity. Building mosques, building Muslim schools, Muslim cemeteries…
Sid: I see all over America there are mosques coming up.
Mark: It is more than 200 mosques in the city of London itself.
Sid: Hmm.
Mark: Yes.
Sid: In your book you talk about there is 3 stages of Jihad, or a holy war. So what are those 3 stages?
Mark: The 3 stages it was presented by the life of Mohammed himself. This is the example for the Muslims and the Muslim movement around the world today. The first stage is the Weaker Time or the Weaker Stage. Weaker stage means the time when Mohammed was living in Mecca for 12 years. He has no power, he has not many people living around him, he has no ability to fight his enemies or the people that stand against him. So this is the Weaker Stage, and the Muslim he must require by the Quran and the Hadith he must have patience and must prepare himself for the second stage.
Sid: Now in that weakened stage would Muslims obey the law in the land if they’re just a small minority?
Mark: Yes they can do that yes.
Sid: The goal then is to increase their numbers I would assume.
Mark: To increase their numbers and start to prepare themselves for establishing a power.
Sid: Okay what is the second…
Mark: The second stage.
Sid: Tell me… explain the second stage.
Mark: The second stage is when Muslims they going to settle somewhere and they’re going to increase their number and they’re going to use their mission activity reaching out to people…
Sid: I’m sorry we’re out of time.
